You get paid what??

The touring industry can feel like the wild west when it comes to finances. We Tour recently posted a job with a pretty high weekly rate for a small club tour. We received a few comments from folks concerned that they were undercharging for their work, so let's discuss it. As far as I know, there isn't a place for the money discussion in touring, so here it is. This is now the place.

You are strongly encouraged to leave comments on this blog. You can remain anonymous by submitting a comment with an alias or use you real name—whatever you want. All we ask is that you are honest about your role on tour and what you are paid to do it. If I’ve left something out, bring it up in the comments. 

Let’s work this shit out.

To Start 

I'm going to speak as a TM/FOH because that’s what I do and I know that market pretty well, but some of this stuff can apply to all kinds of positions, even those not in the touring world.

In my experience, you get offered a rate for the gig and you either take it or you don’t. You might be able to negotiate a little, but it is what it is. Some job offers come with a warning that the offer is low, but “they’re really great guys” or “there’s room to grow with the band”—whatever that means. Word from the wise: if you accept a low-paying job, it will always stay a low-paying job. It ain't gonna go up.

Occasionally, someone will ask you what your rate is right away, and that’s just silly. How can you possibly know that before you have any details? This is how I handle that situation: “I would start the discussion at $/day + PD + advance rate, but I’m open to reevaluating after we’ve had a chance to speak further about the tour.” Or, “There are a ton of variables to discuss, but once we get through those, I’m sure we can find a number that works for me and keeps the tour on budget.”

Variables 

There are an incredible number of variables when coming up with a rate. Does the band travel in a van or a bus? Is there a trailer or truck involved? Do they have a control package (consoles)? How many other people are in the crew? What size venues are they playing? Will there be catering or buyouts? If the tour is going to absolutely consume your life while you’re on it, what is your time, brainpower, and lack of sleep worth to you? Are there other crew members there to help you, or are you the only person who will know what’s going on—huge variable? Unfortunately, the tours that usually take the most mental and physical work are the ones that pay the least, but really, everyone should go on these tours to either gain experience or understand the ins and outs of going out with a small tour.

On top of that, what is your skill set? What are your strengths and weaknesses, and how specifically are you adding value to the tour? For instance, you have an extremely detailed accounting and filing system when you tour manage. Your road report is stunning and business managers love you. You add value to the TM role because you make the accounting work easier for management. Or, you’re super strong, can lift anything, and are knowledgeable about what you do and never complain. You load in and out, drive the van, and make friends with the local crew, and everyone loves working with you. You add value to the touring experience for the crew you’re touring with.

Side Note 

I want to veer off here and talk about applying for gigs. All that stuff I just said about how you specifically add value should be included in the very first correspondence with the person hiring. Tell them straight up where you add value to the tour and fuckin list all of it. Let them know right away that you’re more than just a FOH or TM or whatever and explain what it’s like to tour with you. (There’s another blog with more details on the blog page.)

I'll Show you mine if you show me yours.

Okay, back to it. There’s really no way to suggest a wage for any specific person or tour. There’s only a way to set a blurry guideline for the average baseline. Here’s my super private details for you all to see:

I’ve been an audio engineer for 20 years. I ran a music venue for 12 years. I’ve been touring for 8 years. I’ve been a tour manager for 5 years. I’m a low-stress person who actually enjoys touring, and I’m the most self-sufficient person you’ll ever meet. I also do not take shit from anyone in a very polite way.

As an audio engineer, I can confidently say there isn’t a venue I can walk into that I couldn’t make a show happen in. If it’s a proper venue, the show will sound the best that venue can sound. I understand what it’s like to run a house, tour in large and small tours, production manage, stage manage festivals, but I’m still relatively new to TM'ing and I learn something new every tour. I’m still willing to take a gnarly van tour to learn some things before I consider myself a veteran TM.

My base rate to TM/FOH is $400/day + per diem + $100 per show to advance. This means I get paid $400 every day, including travel and off days, per diem every day, and if there are 20 shows on the tour, I get an additional $2000 to advance it, which will be invoiced before the tour starts. If it’s a van tour, I ask for a solo hotel room. I’m a 40-year-old woman, and I need to be alone in a room without pants on for at least a few hours a day to stay happy.

What do you do? What do you charge? What number will immediately make you turn down a tour? What’s the most you’ve been paid to do what you do?

All comments are moderated, so don’t be a twat.